Building a Green Lifestyle in and Out of the Office
Eric Henry, TS Designs
Living a sustainable life is for hippies and tree huggers. It’s too much work for the average person to make any real difference.
Thankfully, both those statements are false. Taking care of the planet is for everybody. Of course, sustainability is a journey, not a destination. The important thing is that you start trying in whatever way you can. For some people, that means switching to a reusable coffee cup instead of using plastic or picking up a few pieces of litter on your way to work every day.
For Eric Henry, President of TS Designs, it meant becoming one of North Carolina's first B Corporations and a provider of high-quality printed apparel using a domestic transparent and trackable supply chain. Eric is also heavily involved in downtown revitalization efforts in his hometown of Burlington, North Carolina. He has founded organizations like the Burlington Biodiesel Coop and Burlington Beerworks. Additionally, Eric is developing a permaculture plan for his 12-acre farm and is converting his house into a net-zero energy home. Whatever your efforts look like — sustainability begins with you.
In this episode, Host Ben Cash, along with Guest Host Stacey Bailey, sits down with Eric Henry, President of TS Designs, to discuss his passion for sustainability. Eric talks about his journey to become a B Corp business, how he creates a green culture among employees, and ways you can start making a difference today.
Here's a glimpse of what you'll learn:
Eric Henry shares how he became passionate about people, the planet, and profit
What obstacles did Eric face while trying to become a B Corp business?
Advantages of the B Corp community
How to deal with skeptics
Walking the talk — building a green lifestyle in and out of the office
How TS Designs navigated the challenges of the pandemic
Sustainability is a journey, not a destination
Small changes you can make today to live a little greener
Resources mentioned in this episode:
Sponsor for this episode...
This episode is brought to you by Reason One, a group of problem-solvers and change-makers who help those who do good, do better. Whether you work in healthcare, a nonprofit, or a mission-driven organization, we help create beautiful, effective experiences for you and the people you care about.
Start turning your meaning into the message and your audience into advocates. Visit reasonone.com today.
Episode Transcript
Ben Cash 0:06
This is For the Better, a podcast for those working to effect change within their team, organization, or communities. I'm your host, Ben Cash. Thanks for tuning in to the podcast, where we talk with leaders and change makers from purpose driven organizations, and discuss the great things they're doing. The podcast is produced by Reason One, a full service digital agency, helping those who do good, do better. I've got two people joining me today, a guest and a guest co host. More than that they are to change minded people at different stages of a similar journey, how to use business as a force for good. And before we introduce our guests, I wanted to set the stage a little bit with my guest co-host, Stacey Bailey. Hey, Stacey. Hello. Not only she joined me in this conversation, she is our COO at Reason One, and also our B Corp ambassador. And I just want to give a little little context for why we're gonna have Stacey in the conversation today. Our mission and vision has been an evolution over the years. And initially, our our reason for existing was about serving purpose driven organizations and businesses and amplifying, you know, their their good works through digital services. And a certain point for us it was just became, it just wasn't enough. And we wanted to use our business itself in a more sustainable, impactful way. You know, whether that's in our community, our industry or people, and figuring out what that looked like and felt like, started with Stacey, honestly. And so I want to start this off with a question to you, Stacey. Why did you advocate for Reason One to become a B Corp.
Stacey Bailey 2:05
Because of Eric. Back in the before times, we were lucky enough to go to the Charleston Lowcountry, local first good business summit, where Eric was I believe, a panelist or was a speaker. And they were talking to a lot of businesses about not specifically about B Corp, but about using the business as a force for good which the B Corp is certainly a part of. After that, we went back and explored what we were doing and how it might suit us as a business and where we were going with our, our new Reason, One identity. And it felt really aligned. I think, Ben, you and I had a conversation with Eric, where we said, Can we do this? How easy is this? And he said, You can do it. But it's not easy.
Ben Cash 2:55
By the way I should I should qualify that. The Eric she's referring to is actually our guests, yes, you're gonna hear.
Stacey Bailey 3:05
He's hiding in the wings. But really, I wanted us to use our business in the best way possible. We're a small business. But it doesn't seem insurmountable that we can make an impact in our little nick of the world. And I think Ben, as you've said, you know, it's, it's hard to spend a lot of time outside of work doing as much as you might want to do. And when we spend so much time at work, can we make the work about making an impact? So been excited to be on that journey? And, and for what we might explore more today? Yeah,
Ben Cash 3:39
Yeah, and Stacey just elaborate on that a little bit. When you were when we were starting this out for you? What did it mean, pragmatically, you know, being a B Corp, with our business, knowing there's different kinds of businesses, you know, for us specifically, what was that like for you? Were you
Stacey Bailey 3:56
I think exploring how a service based business can make practical decisions for our people, and our people being our employees and our team and also for our clients. You know, things as simple in air quotes, as paying living wages, and doing those sorts of things that are just good business practices. But when you recognize that that isn't necessarily the standard across the world, and by doing that, you actually do set yourself apart and you are making a positive impact. So what more can we do so, so exploring practices, from policies, to services to the product, our digital product and the way we go about making it and also being a you know, an international organization where we have people in Canada and in Ireland and in the US, there's this global element to to our team that I feel like also has to be taken into consideration.
Ben Cash 4:55
So as Stacey mentioned, we heard Eric speak at Good Business Summit. And so I'm going to like introduce Eric now Hey, Eric. Come out of the wings there.
Unknown Speaker 5:09
There you go, technology works.
Ben Cash 5:12
Alright, welcome, welcome today. So, just to set the stage for Eric, so people knows who Eric is, you know, he's doing a little little research on your, on your website, reading your bio, and it's a pretty long bio, you've been been a busy dude. And so you know, if this was a, it was an exercise to get this down to something that could share within this timeframe. So a certainly a renaissance man, I think the first and foremost you are president of TS Designs, which is North Carolina's first B Corp. and manufacturer provider of high quality printed apparel, using a domestic transparent and trackable supply chain, which I'm sure you're gonna get into for us later explain. And if that wasn't enough on its own, he's heavily involved in downtown revitalization efforts in his hometown of Burlington, North Carolina, and is spearheaded or founded organizations like Burlington biodiesel Co Op, Burlington, Beerworks. And I believe a community grocery at one point and is obvious free time. It's also developed a to me if I get this right here, a permaculture plan for his 12 acre farm, and is converting his house into a net zero energy home. So the first question I have to you is, when do you sleep?
Eric Henry 6:44
Well, first of all, Stacey, Ben, thank you so much opportunity to come on today. And it's always good to connect with like minded souls. First of all, that one advantage I have, I'm much older than you are. So I've been at this a long time, and in our lives everywhere. But the other thing, too, is, you know, I had a wake up call very early my business career about what business is. And that was being in the textile business that I started while I was at NC State 1978. And I love to tell young kids 1978, you know, there was no internet, there's no cell phones, there's no fax machines, it was pretty simple. And back then, it was all about the bottom line. And that was the path I was on. I was doing it like everybody else did. And we grew a business to over 100 employees working for a lot of brands, you would recognize Nike Tommy gap, the leaders of the banks loved us, we moved in the facility that we're still in today, borrowing money was not a problem, making money was not a problem. But then January 1 1994, NAFTA rolls in the North American Free Trade Agreement. And literally within two years, all those brands I just mentioned left, and we got down to either 12 or 14 employees. And I'm going like, what happened, I did everything I was supposed to do. I'm invested in my people invested in the business, and it was destroyed. And so that was a wake up call. And I was all you know, live in businesses a lot of luck. And I was lucky to meet a good friend of mine, his recently retired went on to get a PhD in international sustainability and bliss, what his title was. But he introduced this idea of a triple bottom line, people planet profit. And this was a few years before and after. So we started doing these, what a lot of people thought was very crazy. We had a four acre piece of property, we built our building. So we immediately started literally not mowing our grass and planting trees in a Industrial Park everybody Moser grass every day of the week if it needs it or not. And so we were again, fortunate and lucky that we cared about our employees that worked here, we've never paid minimum wage. And again, back in those days in encode a living wage, we just didn't pay a minimum wage. We always had benefits because our employees are our most valuable asset. So we understood the people side of it. And then I've kind of grow grow has grown up as a tree hugger. always cared about the environment. Where that got started. Maybe it was the organic garden I had by my parents house when I was growing up. And back then it was organic by default because industrial ag hadn't started yet. So lucky of time lucky people. NAFTA rolls in. We pretty much get wiped off the map. Our community gets wiped off the map. Though it was either you either go overseas or go out a business and we said, No, we're gonna go a different path. And we started to stay in the domestic business, it was extremely tough deal kind of tough. Now we'll talk more about what's happening today. But it's tough then because, again, the focus quickly moved to oh my gosh, we can get it manufactured so much cheaper over there. Nobody was talking about the people aspect, I always tell my planets, oh, my gosh, it's so much cheaper. They're so the fault relies on I think three areas, first of all, you know, the government for not realizing what they were opening up, when they just says we're going to let this new trade agreement, you know, the market determined the winners, only looking at, you know, the bottom line, because, again, we were working with different environmental rules here, then we're Mexico. We fought the brands, the brands basically just took a blind eye to, yes, we're gonna make so much, it's gonna be so much less expensive to make it over there. But we're not gonna really, you know, care what they do with the people are they what happens to the environment. And then the third in the most important responsibility, we the consumer, we have a responsibility to that decision we make every day we buy a product. And we and I was caught into Oh, my gosh, we can get it, you know, I'm looking you own this 50 inch TV, that was $500. But I don't want to know the manufacturing story behind this TV there. Well, we've we've done that with with our apparel, because per one of my TED talks, 98% of clothes by day are made overseas, and that has not changed much. So. But that put us on the journey. And I always like to say sustainability is a journey, not a destination. And it's put us on that path. And it's pretty much built into our DNA to where we are today. And we were going forward. But again, it was that having our business destroyed by NAFTA, put us on the path that we're own. And really, I would say, accelerated what we're doing. And while we're doing that, of having to do that, so that's a quick snapshot of Yeah, who we are, what we do.
Ben Cash 12:28
That's, that's, that's phenomenal. Thank you for sharing that. You know, I think what would be interesting to put in perspective is that, even though we're all talking about B Corp, and I think it's, it's, there is some awareness of the triple bottom line as you as you put it. That started I think, officially in maybe B labs, like with the entity that you started B corps in maybe 2006 2007. And you were doing this in the 90s. Right. So, you know, that would be a very different environment. And when you're trying to do things and supply chain is very complex and intertwined. You know, what are the obstacles that you were facing when you were trying to do this kind of almost alone, if you will?
Eric Henry 13:11
Well, one thing we realized, I mean, becoming a part of the B Corp community was just again, another lucky choice. What had happened is, we were looking at another certification because we had developed a printing process called RE Hance, which is still unique to the industry. It's a water based technology, we print the garment dye. And we did it for two reasons, not only create a higher quality printed t shirt, but also improve our environmental impact, again, people in planning. So we knew that we needed to have some kind of certification, not just you know, marketing hype that says this string, right. So again, back to Sam Bohr, that introduces triple bottom line. It was working on his PhD, we hired it, it sold his business. We hired him as a consultant to do this certification for the process. And it's I think they're out of Germany. OekoTex is the certification winner for this. And while that was going on, and he was working on it, I had a couple friends, Matt and Okay. Scott from indigenous designs, also in the apparel world and West Coast. You know, which I've known to trade shows and whatever and they said you need to look at this, you know, new B Corp thing and took a look at it because we did we knew down the road and Jay is as hopefully this movement will continue to grow. It will also get hijacked by people that are just looking for the marketing hype by being environmentally conscious. And, you know, we see that every day with quote, it's natural, or it's, you know, what does that mean? So we knew that we weren't Have something that set outside of TS Designs that validates what we're doing and not just saying, Hey, we're doing this, this work here, we're doing it for ya. So we just, by chance, hung our hat on the V core community and they might have been, I think we came in the second year. And I didn't want to clarify being I just found out when we were getting recertified, because I said, for years, we were the first in North Carolina, we actually were the second North Carolina. There was a company out of Asheville. Gao, what is Michael's business name, it's an investment type company. Big, big capital big something astronaut. Yeah, that was the first or the second. But even at that time, there was like, maybe 50 companies involved in this, and we went to the first retreat, you know, might have been 20 of us there at some rustic cabin out in California. And now we've seen which was over 3000 or so, companies are part still a small part of the overall business community, but it has grown. But it was just a lucky choice that we decide that and we're glad we did, and we're honored to be a part of them, are part of it.
Stacey Bailey 16:15
Now, we we are, I think two years into that journey. You know, when we met with you several years ago, and you said it takes a time, and it is labor intensive, but it's worth it, it's worth the effort of the community, you know, we started laying our groundwork and doing our research, we were lucky enough to get to be a part of a program called Getting to 80, that's out of Canada, that's to B Corp consultants, who help businesses make sure that they're, you know, following the guidelines and getting their paperwork in order as it were to be able to apply. So we were able to submit last December of 2020. And now we are like in our sort of final stage of auditing, if you will, but you know that all to say what is, you know, when you're talking to businesses about about why it's worth it, and why the community is worth it? You know, it is labor intensive. It does take work. And and so what do you think the advantage has been to your business to be a officially certified and part of that community?
Eric Henry 17:23
I think it's two things. And one thing, I will commend the B LAB folks, they're always raising the bar and improving the assessment, you know, it's a whole different tool, I think this is a fourth one we've gone through. And so when you go through the assessment, you learn things about yourself, or you they ask questions, oh, I never thought about that before. And so they get you thinking internally, maybe we do that. So it's, it's an internal check. But then the thing that I really have enjoyed, and again, this was, you know, pre COVID And who haven't postcode is a Champions retreat. And because now you're in a audience that has like minded values, and they might be anything from, you know, technology business, to a manufacturing business to legal service, or whatever. So, at least it, puts you in a group that, you know, you know, right, when you start that conversation. They've already looked past the, you know, the bottom line, you know, when you go to your local chamber of commerce, you know, you'll get this whole spectrum of people. And it's not a question right from, but you got some people, you know, when I drop the triple bottom line on, they look at me, like, you know, what, you know, what planet that come from, or never even thought about it people planet profit perspective, and that's fine. I mean, that's just where they are. But in this group, you're much further down the pathway. So I've have met so many great people, great friends, and use them as a sounding board, you know, how do you address this and that, so it's twofold. It's internal perspective and learning, and also connected to a community that wants to do better.
Stacey Bailey 19:19
Yeah, absolutely. We, as as the operation side of our house, you know, it was important to me not only as just who I am as a person that we wanted to do this, but also to make it part of our day to day operations, and Sarah Pinelli, who's our VP of people, she and I are, you know, spearheading this together. But, you know, Ben, I'm going to flip it a little bit on you, you know, and Eric for to chime in as well. One thing that we've run into because you mentioned it's not just about marketing, right, and it's not is that there are skeptics right that feel like you're doing it for the marketing juju, or, you know, for the green blushing So I know for us, we wanted our head of people in our head of operations to really be a part of it, because that's what it is for us. But, you know, then you've you've fielded some of that. Is this just about the marketing?
Ben Cash 20:14
Yeah, that's a, that's a great, great point, Stacey. And, you know, move on vulnerability here. We, you know, I'm sure everybody, if you're in business for long enough, you're gonna get some interesting reviews. And, you know, we recently got a Glassdoor review, that was a little skeptical about our motivations behind becoming a B Corp. And it really hit home and made me think about like, what are we, you know? Are we walking the walk enough? Right, are we does it because there's also a public facing aspect of this, and because we're trying to align ourselves with clients that share our values. And that's important. It's something we talked about, which can be misinterpreted as our value proposition rather than our shared DNA, if that makes sense. And so that's something I think we're always aware of. And I think, you know, that kind of feedback makes us look internally, and make sure that we are doing this for the right reasons and making the right investments.
Stacey Bailey 21:16
Can you run into any skeptics that you've had to advocate for, for your position on your choices as a business?
Eric Henry 21:26
Yeah, I mean, there's just mouths, I went to a public hearing, oh, nice, both for our community. I live in a community has no land use planning. And, but I'm also a give love live in this community for over 60 years. So for Chairman burn too many bridges, and I know a few amount of folks. But, you know, I think end of the day, yes, but, but the path we're taking, when you when you get past a skepticism, it is a harder path, because you care more about than, you know, than the money. I mean, the money is important, that's what keeps the lights on. But you know, the path that we're taking cares about those other thing, which is people and planet. And I think ultimately, I mean, that's that, what drives me, I mean, there will be a time that I'm not gonna be on this planet anymore. And I'm just driven to try to leave it better for somebody else, or then people are left behind me. And, you know, I kind of grew up in a time, where success, and people thought happiness was driven by, you know, income and money. And I've learned it's not and again, back to that wake up call with NAFTA, you know, it's not the bigger house, or the more cars and stuff like that. It's, it's the life we live in the people we're connected to. Some of you, you get it, but I always tell them, you know, come on this side. And I think you'll find it's a lot harder. But I think the work is worth it. But you know, yeah, we'll get those people but you know, and just to just to understand, you know, come see what we're doing. And I mean, I don't have any you know, qualms about it. But yes, it's the stuff's hard. I like that. It's hard.
Stacey Bailey 23:18
I like that point that it's, it almost doesn't matter if you've got a skeptic who thinks it's for the marketing power, or whatever they think it is about because it is it is harder, and it is not that whatever payoff they think it's having on the bottom line isn't necessarily there because it's really harder. And it's about connecting with your, your, your people and your your clients in a different way. And finding people that it resonates with both from a business partnership and from a client basis.
Eric Henry 23:52
Well, I'm so I look at your will, you're willing to part of being a part of a community willing to put yourself out there, we are not a perfect company, we have mistakes, we have larger improvement. But there are no secrets either. Right? You know, when you say it that way is, you know, it's just, it's just, you know, I think it's, you're making yourself a lot more vulnerable, because you're let yourself so open. So I think in a way, it's just, it's to me, it's how to operate, how to operate your business and operate your life. And because I think it does, and that you become more connected to who you are and where you are, then if you're just surfaced the own the, you know, there to suck the resources or the revenue out of the system for your own benefit.
Ben Cash 24:45
Yeah, I'm curious Eric too, because, you know, you mentioned that your people are your most important asset, and you've got a very clear vision, you have a very, you're very focused and where you want to go. What's that been like over the years? hiring people that may or may not share the same enthusiasm and passion for building using a business as a force for good as you. But what's that like?
Eric Henry 25:13
And I guess Ben I'll look at two different look at two ways. I'm actually ran for political office last year, okay, I have 64, I describe myself I was the blue.in, the Red Sea. And because of COVID, I got overrun by the Red Sea. But politically, and then religiously, people will know how I feel about things. But I will not force my values upon you. So when it comes to the folks at TS Designs, I mean, we're here to do a job, I'll help you do that job. I'm not, you know, I'm not going to make you have to meet these values that I believe in, you know, religiously, or ethically or I mean, what ethically is not probably not religiously, or politically, I should say. But I have found out, you know, when you create that environment, again, you're walking the talk, I mean, I don't, you know, talk about doing, you know, the guy that came visit me a few years ago that had this green technology in a textile world, and he wanted to market it, but he came up in his, you know, $100,000. 8 mile per gallon Lexus. And I said, I'm not here to judge you. But I says, the community will judge you, you got to walk the talk. So you got to be committed to it. Because I mean, bottom line, he was he wanted to market a green technology, he didn't care anything about the environment. So I think when you walk the talk, and when, when the when the people see you, you know, do what you say you're doing in regards to the impact of people impact the planet, then I have found over we've got four folks villainous over 25 years, and they've gone through tremendous challenges with our company. But they've seen we've committed to our values. And then I think what's happened because that, you know, another success story is let's just say we live in a conservative community. And we didn't have the best vaccine, right? And, and I basically went to them and try to explain as I knew the information was coming about to us and I said, you know, this is not only to protect you protect customers coming into us. But we had no problem with 100% vaccination rate. Zero was no pushback or whatever, you know, we had, we don't have any, you know, used to have smokers who are smokers anymore. And it's not that there's, you know, I'm gonna go through and beat you because you smoke. You know, I tried to demonstrate, you know, hopefully a healthy lifestyle, you know, we you know, is the hours go tell is living in business, the details. That's important. You know, a lot of times I see in businesses, they get on this, you know, I'm gonna do X, but then when you look at it, you'll I was wrong, you know, we you know, there's no, you know, when we have coffee here, you know, it's Fairtrade organic coffee, it's not, you know, storebought, Maxwell House, or whatever. I mean, it's all those little things, you know, it's LED lighting in his office here. So, all these things cost the company money, but it relates to the values that we believe in.
Ben Cash 28:24
And you do one thing is how you do everything.
Eric Henry 28:27
Yeah. Walking the talk, right?
Stacey Bailey 28:29
You mentioned you know, NAFTA being an overhaul, and now COVID being its own new version of that. What has How have your values helped, you know, keep you afloat? Through through this most recent experience that we're still in?
Eric Henry 28:51
Well, I mean, you know, we had no idea I never forget, I was on a plane on February 2020. And a good friend of mine, who's retired doctor read something in a medical journal says, I think this can be a problem. This is before it was a prominent Seattle Portland first place and so obviously impacted our business. A lot of our customers shut down slow down, closed down. And but I like to tell the story is, you know, how do we again sticking to our values of people and planet. Everybody was jumping into the mask business. And so we decided participant number we took those vase of people in planet. So we took our US made irregular T shirts. We partnered up with a cut so cut me about 30 miles away in Asheboro. And we got to the mass business and, and I love to tell that story because I had no idea how to make a mass. And the first couple mass we made were crap, because we know we're doing but because We're with a in a connected local supply chain, we were able to do real time product development. This is, although you can wear warm, but this is our math today. You know, we've got all kinds of features, it's got the neck strap, it's got a filter parts, got a filter in it now all this, then went through 12 design changes. Well, we were able to do that real time in COVID, compared to design in New York and made in Vietnam, or so that what so we were real time design, we were selling direct to consumer. So we were interested in making masks for our community, we're not interested, we you know, these fields don't make it to me, I'm not, I can't make me mascot, so make me mass. But I'm gonna keep. So we created jobs or kept jobs, we basically took material that basically was upcycled mask. The other thing that COVID has shown us is that because we have a connected supply chain, we can micromanage our inventory levels, because remember, there was a time in the spring of last year, hey, we're out of this thing. Let's go back to work. And so we drove our inventory down about zero, here comes Delta jacket back up. Same thing happened to fall on the ground. Same thing happened. And so we ramped, so we're able to micromanage. Imagine those companies, they got a million mass sitting down the coast of LA. And now we found out two weeks ago, the government's gonna start us is gonna give you free masks. So people have seen what we've done in masks, they've seen what we've done with apparel. And because we're able to manage this very tight supply chain, there's a tremendous value to that beyond just what the price of the mask is, because I don't have I have 100,000 mass back there, I might have 100. And so I think what COVID did for us compared to NAFTA, it exposed a lot greater group of people of how fragmented and fragile this global supply chain is. And because NAFTA just affected the apparel industry, either you or the manufacturer that lost your job, or your the person got cheaper clothes will have infected, you know, when went to the grocery store or whatever, you know, in fact, a lot, so a lot more conversations, a lot more activity, a lot more business. But I think, in a way, there's a potential silver lining here is, again, lucky of life that I actually started a business, in a community that has, as we say, dirt to shirt, but all the resources from the raw cotton to the finished apparel, we can do it all in 600 miles. And and we can be very agile, and move very quickly. And we're able to do it during COVID. And I think a lot is S That's a good way to do business, because there will be some future global disruption. You know, is it a pandemic? Is it a strikers at war, whatever. And we're not going to put the genie back in the bottle when it comes to globalization. But we can, in your own your community to remind you there are there things in your community that make you unique, understand what those are, connect with those and build those things up. And those will be important things, especially in tough times.
Ben Cash 33:27
What do you think that? Why? Why aren't more people doing what you're doing? What were some of the obstacles? You know, let's say there's another owner of a business out there, you know, experienced the challenges you're talking about? Wants to shift? Like, how hard is it to get there? How hard is it to change your business in this way and in your type of business, that that does involve supply chain and manufacturing and sourcing and
Eric Henry 33:57
well being I like to say and I said earlier, you know, sustainability is a journey, not a destination. And all I'm interested in is people that want to be on that path. I don't care where you are on that path, as long as you're on that path become more sustainable. And then once you decide that, and another thing I'd love to say to the college kids is, you know, we're unsaid you too every day of your life, you're making a decision, some financial decision, you're buying a cup of coffee, you're buying up a new laptop, or you know, you're making you're making a financial decision in a typical global economy. If you're starting out or food related, you know, go and buy some, you know, fast food, local food, whatever. But we're so trained with What's it cost and you got to know that but ask the question, what is the social environmental impact I'm making the decision I'm doing right now. And you know, again, I've been doing this since the 90s. So but if you do that It does two things, it basically become more educated in what you're doing. And then you become more connected to why you're doing it. And the local food, that's the best. I mean, we moved from downtown Burlington out to a farm area to be around other farms to be more connected, because understand the value, and it's just, you just build these relationships. So I think it's true with with any business or any person is everything we do everyday has an impact. And so just start asking yourself, you know, what is that impact I'm having? And what can I do to make it in a more positive way? And I think, you know, just day every, every day, there's something that comes up, that you can probably do it a little bit differently.
Ben Cash 35:45
Yeah. And I want to ask one last question here. We're getting close to time. You know, a lot about the industry in the business, and also the personal choices, as you say, what would what is a choice? Or what is a? What is something that people would be surprised about? That is a very common choice that they can change to make a difference? What is something that people be surprised about?
Eric Henry 36:14
Oh, gosh. I mean, it amazes me. And it's um, I was put some LinkedIn today. You know, when you go to the grocery store, and they put it in as cheesy as plastic bags for father, he either banned the plastic bag, charging 10 cents for him. And in his personal so I had a recycling, this is why you've been recycling lunches, bring your own back to the store. You know, it's like not, you know, I drink way too much coffee, but you'll never see me, you know, usually you'll see me I'll have my own coffee thing in my hand, it stays, it's usually glued to my hand. But it's little things like that. I mean, because they touch our lives everyday. I mean, how many times you've been in the store, and you buy one item, and they want to put that one item in a bag. You know, we have to break bad habits. So it's, that happens to us, you know, every day of our life. But that's just a couple quick things that come to mind. And it's just, you know, but but we get so accustomed to it. It's so used to it, you know, you know, I get a bag of chips and says I'm gonna put it back in chips in a bag, why you put a bag in a bag? I mean, you know, anyway, but it's just just what you see people do it all the time. But like to go ahead, Stacey, I was
Stacey Bailey 37:31
gonna say I like to think about that from a terms of, there's a, like a diet health mindset where if you start your day making good food choices, you will continue to make good food choices to the rest of your day. And I think similarly about sustainability and omit about making those choices when you start by, you know, bringing your bag or using a coffee cup, your micro impact isn't huge, but it makes you think about every choice you make. When you're purchasing things. When you're making choices about waste, my son and I pick up litter on the way to school, there's litter in the same spot every day. Our litter pickup isn't fundamentally changing the litter problem, but it does help us think about everything that we're doing and all the choices we're making. And hopefully someone else sees us picking up litter and wants to do the same thing. I think that that's part of the big part of sustainability is like everyone doing a small piece and influencing each other's decisions. And I think that's what's really interesting about B Corp and businesses like yourself, I am one of those people who will pay whatever the difference in the margin is to buy something if it's especially if it's got a B Corp label on it, when I'm in the grocery store, it's like a no brainer to make that decision or to find out a bit find a business like yours. So those consumer decisions are, are very real and make an impact on businesses like yours and hopefully like like ours, where we're working towards our sustainable websites. That's our new, you know, mindset of trying to figure out how we're going to make these digital services more sustainable and and align with our business values and practices as well.
Eric Henry 39:10
Yes, basically, what I like to say is that we don't live in a perfect world. And if you try to make it a perfect world, you will be an unhappy person. And two examples I use of that is a fantastic wife of over 30 years. And you know, but she's been around me long enough, you know, she'll bring some new outfit that she really likes. That least she's looked at the label, you know, used to be out says will you know where that was made? He told no, no, no, no. Now she she has already gone through that process. Dogs app Ali was right down the road from here is a Wendy's hamburger chain. And I know when I go there, it's not good for me at my health. It's probably not a good place for employees. It's not a good place for the animals. But sometimes it's a situation where I've got to get something because I've got to go to Some meetings you've got planned, I'm going to be late, I haven't eaten all day now, don't get something new, I have a headache. And just so I do make some rationalization to go there. But at least I'm thinking about this. And if nothing else, I'm probably there maybe once a month, and not every other day. And that so just, you know, some people get so wrapped up, it is not a perfect world, just as long as you're trying to be aware of the impact that you're having. And then how can you do better next time and doing that. So it's just, it's a lot, you know, it's tough, but just keep telling you just be aware of what you're doing every day and don't beat yourself up when you fall short.
Ben Cash 40:45
If it's a great, great way of thinking about it. You seem very plugged in, especially in your own community. And in the greater B Corp world, is there anybody that you think that you'd recommend that we listen to? Like, who's somebody to follow? Who's somebody that a podcast to listen to? Or article or book to read? Who should we connect with?
Eric Henry 41:09
Yes, that question earlier? I can't. Who do you listen to specific no specific names come into, but what I would do like I like to say, it's just it's keeping, put yourself out there and stay connected. You know, that's the thing with I tell about B Corp go that, you know, the the annual retreat in the people you meet I mean, there's it is always to say another thing to be in it's, it's not one person has the answer to the community's lives within the answer. You just constantly put yourself out there. With you're in what happens too is our customer base, you know, they don't come here because they want cheap T shirts, they've gone somewhere as long time ago. So there's a lot of cool people in my customer base, you know, that they're under maybe, maybe, maybe, or maybe not no understanding, but the B Corp community, but they're on this same journey. So I'm just looking for people, it just is it is a, you know, from from the farmer, to the business owner, you know, just I just always will put myself out there and engage with those people and learn from those people. But to give a specific podcast or specific person, nothing comes to mind right now, other than it's just an honor to be connected with the community that y'all are a part of.
Ben Cash 42:27
I couldn't agree more. And it's, of course, it was how we connected, right, we saw you speak. My friend, Joel Sadler, you know, I think introduced us when we went to the first talk, it's just it's, it's, you know, staying connected in that community. And I think that's a great spot to end things. I do want to give a shout out to your to your business. TSDesigns.com. And if you if any of you want to buy the best sustainable t shirt in the world, made in the USA, from dirt to shirt, go to tsdesigns.com. And I think what you'd said was that solid state DOT clothing is your more your modern take on consumer consumer right, and where you can get some additional great quality apparel. So please go check those out. And thank you so much for your time, Stacey, thanks for joining as well. Yeah, this has been a great conversation. And looking forward to staying connected.
Eric Henry 43:36
Thank you, Ben. And thank you Stacey. Stay warm out there and hope our paths cross soon.
Ben Cash 43:42
All right. Take care everybody.
This has been an episode of For the Better for more information episodes or to be a guest on the podcast visit FoftheBetterpodcast.com Thanks all be well.